Isn't poverty the real issue here - standards in education are a by-product of poverty

If the Australian government addressed the issue of poverty in this country than we would see very different results in education (and many other areas of life).

In the majority of cases, schools with high performing academic results are largely represented by high to middle income areas. Schools that have low academic results are largely represented by low socio-economic families.

The issues of inequity & social disadvantage are the real issue - standards in education are a by-product of poverty.

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Permalink Reply by Katrina Smith on January 31, 2010 at 8:36

Not always, but often.

Permalink Reply by Samuel Burke on January 31, 2010 at 9:39

I do agree with what you are saying and from reading the many comments posted on this website I'm afraid that the gap is going to widen.

Educators in tough areas do their best to bring the 'tail end' up. They face obstacles and challenges (including being 'bashed' on this website).

Permalink Reply by karenleeanne on February 5, 2010 at 17:42

Awesome, thanks Mike. I will check out Alfie & the statement

thanks

Karen

Permalink Reply by karenleeanne on January 31, 2010 at 10:15

Hi Alex and Samuel

Agreed, absolutely. Unfortunately, the way we disperse funds through our Centrelink network does little to raise up the children of poverty.social disadvantage and inequity. Assuming best intentions, I am sure that most involved are trying but perhaps this it is time we the community became more involved.

Personally, I do not believe we are directing the funding as well as we could and I believe that the role of the school HAS to evolve for all our sakes.

Samuel, the bashing that has occured in some of these discussions is not only insulting but I believe largely inaccurate. Please both consider looking at the group - Parents, Teachers, Community for significant positive change to education. All ideas as they are mentioned will be added to the list at the top for us to debate in a positive manner. Who knows where it will lead!
Only positive constructive ideas will be included, I am sure you have much to offer, please recruit like-minded friends & colleagues.

cheers

Karen

Permalink Reply by Mary Jackson on January 31, 2010 at 20:00

The CHILDREN born into these families deserve the opportunity to mix with all walks of life. They deserve excellent education and the opportunity to rise above the circumstances into which they have been born. It is not their fault that their parents ' snort, sniff or inject, spend money at night clubs etc' yet, in the majority of cases it is these children that perform poorly at school. Can you even imagine trying to take in a new mathematical concept when the only thing in your cupboard for breakfast was vegetable oil because mum didn't have money for groceries this week?!?
If we addressed the causes of poverty than we may start to see some equity in this country.
Australia has the highest social gradient of all OECD countries. The gap between literacy levels of the advantaged and disadvantaged in this country are the most significant of all OECD countries (and this was stated by Barry McGaw the director of this website at an Educational Leaders Conference)
"SOCIAL DIFFERENCE IN THIS COUNTRY MAKES MORE DIFFERENCE IN AUSTRALIA THAN OTHER PERFORMING COUNTRIES". There's got to be something in that, doesn't there?

Permalink Reply by Jamus O'Brien on January 31, 2010 at 20:05

There sure does Mary. I think it's been mentioned here quite a few times that these rankings are more a reflection on the parents than the kids - and I couldn't agree more!

Permalink Reply by karenleeanne on January 31, 2010 at 20:49

In my opinion all here are speaking a lot of sense and truth, the only thing that appears to be in question is what to do about it.

I personally, third hand; know of a young single Mum who spent all of the extra money provided by the Govt stimulus packages etc for her children in the last year, on drugs. I make no judgements about this Mum, I have not walked in her shoes. Her children were taken from her for a month due to abuse and then sent back because they could not find a permanent home for them in foster care that she would agree to.

What I am saying is, how do we make sure her children are okay, that they have access to the resources that money was intended for. See, from my point of view, there is only one place where all these children go............... School!
I understand what I am saying is socialist but for goodness sake does this not start to add up? Yes, everyone is entitled to dignity and a hand up, surely this comes with some obligations and boundaries.

Put the resources or at least some of it into schools. Provide the disadvantaged children with their uniforms, books, resources, excursions, specialist support staff, take better care of our teachers who deal with this daily etc and make sure these children benefit from at least some of the money that was intended for them in the first place. Please understand I am NOT making judgements about benefit recipients, I am just saying that we HAVE TO begin guaranteeing that money goes where it is intended.

Surely, the less disadvantaged they are, less anger, bad behaviour and a better learning environment for all other students and teachers

Permalink Reply by Jamus O'Brien on January 31, 2010 at 23:54

Perhaps, just maybe, as a society, we have got too soft?

The dole is no longer a stigma - it's a right! Why work if you don't have to?

An unmarried mother was once considered to have made "a mistake" - now days, no one blinks an eye at 3,4 or 5 "mistakes". It's OK - the baby bonus comes in plus an income until their 18. Shag whoever you want to - there are no consequences. It's their right to do whatever they want with their own body.

And don't you dare take a child out of an abusive home - Stolen Generation and all that sort of stuff - they have rights!

And why should teachers be able to disciple MY child with a cane - my child has rights - regardless of what they have done!

So what is the problem here? To many rights make a wrong!

OK, you are all now formally invited to flood my email box with complaints about generalisations/bias/racially motivated comments....and so on.

Permalink Reply by MySchool on February 1, 2010 at 0:09

From a school perspective, the kids didn't choose their parents or their lifestyle.

Permalink Reply by Neridah Brooke-adams on February 6, 2010 at 9:23

and some parents didnt choose the cards life dealt them either.

Permalink Reply by Oliva on February 5, 2010 at 8:56

I agree...So what is the problem here? To many rights make a wrong!
Too many young people[and adults too] are opting out of the responsibility of earning their own living and competing because Centrelink has a generous program of handouts to suit every case. This socialist "spread the wealth" approach to domestic support is creating career welfare dependants and increasing the tax bill for those who choose to make their own way and pay their own bills.
We could so easily become like Europe where young and not so young people living on welfare and education grants total up to 39% reportedly of the population in some countries.
Government always takes a long time to turn around. Responding to a need that has begun to fester catches many more votes than acting pro-actively in dealing with the need before it becomes an "issue"

Permalink Reply by karenleeanne on February 7, 2010 at 0:22

Unfortunately Jamus, much of the time children are not taken from abusive homes because there are too few many foster homes to place them all.

As for your comments about unmarried mothers, I have suggested previously that it is concerning that some people certainly do appear to have more children to get more benefits. However, if you are suggesting we devolve back to the previous way of thinking, surely we can do better than that?